Craig: Today I began to introduce Mike to the decipherment process for the project and tomorrow I plan to do the same with Rob. I also re-watched the the film Viking Visitors to North America, as the first time I watched this film I was operating the computer and projector for Myron's lecture in March and was not able to pay attention to the whole film. Also the group has made an appointment for a phone interview tomorrow with a Kensington Runestone scholar. As for my decipherment today I continued with the last part of MENALTING--which would be TING and was unsuccessful in finding a direct match but for MENALTING here is what I have found with help from Myron. MINO (VOL. 4-81) ALA (VOL. 1-9) TAN (VOL. 1-195). Although this stanza is not complete I feel I must go over some of the other decipherments for this Stanza, but here is a working Old Norse paraphrase : A Few Hunters Had Put Together A Meeting (this is one word I am worried about), That Good Half.
Until tomorrow
Craig
Craig
ReplyDeleteHere is what I came up with. I had little time for a full analysis. This might be an education stanza for all three of you to analyze.
Original English = They having died,
Recorded phrase = Ango melchik
Lenape words = Ango melchat 4.12, 6.63 1
Old Norse words = Engi mi kill 2
Norse/English = not many 3
Paraphrase = "A few"
1. Vowels interchangable. k-t in same cluster.
2. Sherwin's choice seems not correct.
3. Norse/English words are not similar to original.
Original English = The hunters.
Recorded phrase = elowichik
Lenape words = ei-ow chekee 1.45, 5.25
Old Norse words = eiga sterkr
Norse to English = has (violent) strength
Paraphrase (Idiom) "Hunter"
Phrase 3 .
Original English = About to depart
Recorded phrase = el mus i chik
Lenape words = ei-ow mo sog queht (eau) 1.45, 1.109
Old Norse words = eiga no' suu gat aa
Norse to English = had put together
Paraphrase = put together
Phrase 4
Original English = Met together
Recorded phrase = Me n al ting.
Lenape words = Mi no al trac... 4.81, 1.9, 5.195
Old Norse words = Mil dr al throeng 1
Norse to English = good big meeting
I apologize for "throng." "Althing" is a word that I learned from reading many, many books about Norse in the arctic. I thought I had written a suggestion to look on 5.195, but when I reviewed my emails to you, I could not find those words.
Drottkvaett
Alliteration = Bold, Rhyme = italic
Lenape words = very low
An go mel chat ei- ow
chek ee ei- ow mo sog
queht (eau) mi no al trac.
Old Norse,
En gi mi kill ei ga sterkr 1
ei ga no' suu gat aa 2
mil dr al throeng 3
1. Seven syllables in a line is acceptable if last is a strong sound.
2. The first syllable of the second line is an Alliteration, if it matches an alliteration in the first line. The purpose was to key the lines so future generations (us) can pair the odd and even lines.
3. I do not know why the odd "dangle" of several syllables.
Perhaps the stanza maker thought he had met the Alliteration and rhyme criteria in the first two lines and he still had to add a part of a line to transfer information.
Perhaps the last line is the remains of a line, were some syllables were forgotten, sometime.
We should stay alert to see if we can understand why the third line is usual a "dangle."
In this pictograph-stanza combination, I guess that the first two lines were the learned stanza as the information passed through the generations, but the pictograph shows a meeting. So the following generations did remember the words for a meeting, but not the syllables for the third and forth lines the original stanza maker had created. So in this case, the dangle may be extra important words out of the Drottkvaett format.
Alliterations = 6/6
Rhyme = 5/6
toltal = 11/12 = 92%
A passable grade, considering that the third line did not contribute anything.
Also, I think the evidence is that, at this stanza, the stanza maker was thinking in the original Lenape/Old Norse language. The Lenape words of Sherwin would, perhaps, be used generations later.
This decipherment make much more sense although I have a quick question... wht is TRAC cut down from TRACADIE I am just a bit confused on why we can cut words in certain places and keep some of it instead of all of it...this would help further decipherment?
DeleteIn this case, I did violate the usual guide lines, which require finding the Lenape syllables first.
DeleteI did it with knowledge that "alting" was the same as the "All Thing" which occurred in Iceland and Greenland. I found the "Throeng" in the Old Norse words before I noticed that the Lenape "trac" was the first syllable of other words.
The "Throeng" was the syllable we needed. The other words were not useful. So I showed only the first Lenape syllable "Trac" to enable you to find the page where I got the "throeng" syllable.
Apparently my shortened description worked because you found the page and asked, "why?"
When we get through the learning curve, the documentation should be improved.
Thanks for being interested enough to ask a very pertinent question. If I did not explain well enough, do not hesitate to keep asking.